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ReddyMcMeaty · The Boss Joined: 20 May 2006 Posts: 5776

I find that liver doses itself for me. Sometimes I crave it, which is strange because I do not like the flavour. After I've eaten "enough" then the idea of it is disgusting to me. With my last pregnancy I had almost morning sickness for a few months and became obsessed with the idea of liver, so I ate a huge almost raw piece.. all sick feeling went away and I could not eat liver again for almost a year Smile

After these posts I'm going to try small amounts on a weekly basis, just a couple chunks swallowed with water. I have a few of those dry bumps on my upper arms that I'd like to go away.

_________________
"Man lives on one quarter of what he eats. On the other three quarters lives his doctor."

adwred · Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 11:52 pm Post subject:

I love liver, but I agree, it's self-limiting. I once in a while get an extreme craving for pate or panfried calves' liver or foie gras and then I indulge and I'm fine for months and don't even crave it remotely. I figure that's my body telling me that I've had enough. I don't even need to try to avoid having it too often because of the carbs - my body tells me when it wants liver and tells me when it's done having liver. Not that my cravings are always an indication of what I need! But it works for fat, too. Every once in a while, I just need to binge on butter and/or cream and I'm sure it's my body needing a big dose of fat. But then I can go for a week on just eggs, with very little fat added.

People do need to listen to their bodies more closely, methinks.

Speaking of liver cravings, I haven't had it in about 3 months and could use a dose!
_________________
I'm a vegetable-eater by proxy. I make sure to get 5-10 servings of herbivore per day.

steve198329 · Hunter Joined: 03 Mar 2007 Posts: 110

barb0324 · Guest

Does anyone remember doing Weight Watchers in the 70s? Okay, I aged myself, but who cares... Grin

the point is, it was very lowcarb in principle, unlike today... and liver was one of the foods you were encouraged to have once a month. I remember they advertised that you could get liver and onions at Shoney's lol, not sure what made me think of that, but for what it's worth, I am getting some, got a craving right now!

steve198329 · Hunter Joined: 03 Mar 2007 Posts: 110

Sorry I made a mistake. The link I showed is only for 1 once. To see the nutrition stats for 1/4 lb toggle the arow down to the 100g marking. Even so, 1 ounce provides 212% of your vitamin A.

steve198329 · Hunter Joined: 03 Mar 2007 Posts: 110

Here' the article about the overdose of vitamin A. I was wrong in the previous post. I guess it can occur much sooner with high doses. I will only be eating liver for another week daily and I will lower my consumption.

THE MYTH OF VITAMIN A TOXICITY
Typical of the orthodox medical view of vitamin A is the following statement, posted at WebMD.com: "Vitamin A can be very toxic when taken in high-dose supplements for long periods of time and can affect almost every part of the body, including eyes, bones, blood, skin, central nervous system, liver, and genital and urinary tracts. Symptoms include dizziness, nausea, vomiting, headache, skin damage, mental disturbances and, in women, infrequent periods. Severe toxicity can cause blindness and may even be life-threatening. Liver damage can occur in children who take RDA-approved adult levels over prolonged periods of time or in adults who take as little as five times the RDA-approved amount for seven to ten years. In children, chronic overdose can cause fluid on the brain and other symptoms similar to those in adults. Pregnant women who take amounts not much higher than RDA levels increase the risk for birth defects in their children. High consumption of vitamin A may also increase the risk of gastric cancer and the risk of osteoporosis and fractures in women."

The Merck Manual describes vitamin-A toxicity in less hysterical terms. Acute vitamin-A poisoning can occur in children after taking a single dose of synthetic vitamin A in the range of 300,000 IU or a daily dosage of 60,000 IU for a few weeks. Two fatalities have been reported from acute vitamin-A poisoning in children, which manifests as increased intracranial pressure and vomiting. For the vast majority, however, recovery after discontinuation is "spontaneous, with no residual damage."

In adults, according to the Merck Manual, vitamin-A toxicity has been reported in arctic explorers who developed drowsiness, irritability, headaches and vomiting, with subsequent peeling of the skin, within a few hours of ingesting several million units of vitamin A from polar bear or seal liver. Again, these symptoms cleared up with discontinuation of the vitamin-A rich food. Other than this unusual example, however, only vitamin-A from "megavitamin tablets containing vitamin A. . . when taken for a long time" has induced acute toxicity, that is, 100,000 IU synthetic vitamin-A per day taken for many months.

Unless you are an arctic explorer, it is virtually impossible to develop vitamin-A toxicity from food. The putative toxic dose of 100,000 IU per day would be contained in 3 tablespoons of high vitamin cod liver oil, 6 tablespoons of regular cod liver oil, two-and-one-half 100-gram servings of duck liver, about three 100-gram servings of beef liver, seven pounds of butter or 309 egg yolks. Even synthetic vitamin A is not toxic when given as a single large dose or in small amounts on a daily basis. Children in impoverished areas of the world are routinely given two 100,000-unit doses of retinol per year for infants and two 200,000-unit doses for children over 12 months.

The tragedy is that misplaced concern about vitamin-A toxicity has led doctors to advise pregnant women to avoid foods containing vitamin A, and parents to avoid giving cod liver oil to their babies. Yet the early books on the feeding of pregnant women and infants recommended generous doses of cod liver oil and frequent liver consumption for pregnant women and two teaspoons of cod liver oil per day for babies three months and older. A majority of our medical problems would clear up very quickly if the populace would return to eating liver and embrace the use of cod liver oil—our finest superfoods.

Here's more info on the vitamin:
http://www.westonaprice.org/basicnutrition/vitaminasaga.html

Avalon · Top Carnivore Joined: 29 Nov 2006 Posts: 3326

Liver is served!

I haven't had it in a while. This is chicken liver and was actually meant for the cat Roll Eyes

never made it to the cat. This is my first raw chicken liver. I've only had calf's before. The chicken tastes consistency wise much more like raw oysters. The Calf's has more chew. The chicken tasted milder. With soy sauce and italian seasoning.

MEAT EATER!!! Embarassed

paleogirl · Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 3:25 am Post subject:

Way to go Avalon! I totally understand your issues with meat, as do many here (seems an awfully high proportion of ANCer's were former vegans), so with that said, an extra dose of WTG for you! Yup

_________________
"Is it too meaty?"

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BlackLabelSimian · Posted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 6:41 pm Post subject:

I'll stick with my dessicated liver tablets, thanks. Laugh

_________________
"Change. Nothin' stays the same. Unchained...And ya hit the ground runnin'."

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Avalon · Top Carnivore Joined: 29 Nov 2006 Posts: 3326

Thanks, ehh, Paleogirl! One short version is, I've been wanting to switch cat to 'prey model' diet. Involves meat, organs, and bone, basically. Only I froze 4oz container portions of liver- I didn't plan it right. Should have mixed up batches before hand, not just liver only. And Goopy doesn't like it!!@!!@@@ I tried giving him some at the same time I made mine- no go. So I've got like 8 containers, something like that of frozen chicken liver in the freezer...

I'm starting to realize why I feel the way I do, at least. If you start to care for animals, other than cats or dogs or ferrits, beyond a certain marker, then you run the risk of thinking 'do I really want to eat my buddies?' You know? Growing up we had pet fish, hamsters, gerbils and dogs... I must have crossed that marker... but no sex! Shock

Anyway, I'm so confused over what to believe. I've been reading Dean Ornish's Reversing Heart Disease. And though he obviously is siding vegetarian- milk and egg whites are included. The thing is, so he wrote a book. Vonderplanitz wrote a book. The Bear could write a book. Did he? Graham wrote a book. All these doctors and people with letters after their name wrote books! And they all conflict! DOHHH!!! And it still leaves me with a freezer full of liver Yup

It's very weird by the way that your mouth is saying these feel like oysters, but they're not Bonkers

.

Okay, here's the thing, my power has been off all day- new meters being installed so I'm yapping!

When I first found The primal diet I was like, wow! Could this be true?! All these testimonials of good health! Very cool. I've never read his books mostly because of cost, but it is truly 'wild' stuff. Plus I adore sushi! Okay, so I'm just trying to figure it all out. All this means what?

There is an answer here though. I may never find it in my lifetime, maybe I will. Meaning are we Omnivores? Carnivores? Frugivores etc etc. Or, jeeze is there now a definite split in our make-up, that would explain why some gravitate to vegetation, some to flesh. From eons past?

Sorry, ramble time U.S.A. Shock

Best cashews,
Avalon

copychick · Carnivore King Joined: 11 Aug 2006 Posts: 948

xeta, i may be mad, but bare with me for a moment (or bear with me.....ha!) maybe, just for like a month or something, you could shelve all the diet books. take all that you have learned, sit, meditate on it. see what feels good to you and do it. black box it. keep what works, get rid of what doesn't. what makes you feel happy and healthy. obviously there is never going to be one right, proven, tested, iron clad answer. even if we unthaw a whole tribe of ancient man they'd probably argue with some other tribe we unthaw. you've done so much work and study. you know yourself better than anyone. maybe it is time to set sail on Avalon's Diet!

i know, look who's talking! Grin

Avalon · Top Carnivore Joined: 29 Nov 2006 Posts: 3326

Okay, you had me up to 'bare with you' Wow

I almost thought you meant undress Evil

, then I saw that 'Bear' word again! Does he have to be everybear, I mean EVERYWHERE!!!

Actually, you speak many truths, CopyChick. Very wise. Create your very own puzzle from the pieces your learned experience. BUT IT'S NOT EASY BECAUSE I'M SO EASILY SWAYED!!! hey, what's that over there Outta Here

Nicola · Top Cat Joined: 21 Mar 2007 Posts: 379

[quote="Avalon"]Okay, you had me up to 'bare with you' Wow

I almost thought you meant undress Evil

, then I saw that 'Bear' word again! Does he have to be everybear, I mean EVERYWHERE!!!

Actually, you speak many truths, CopyChick. Very wise. Create your very own puzzle from the pieces your learned experience. BUT IT'S NOT EASY BECAUSE I'M SO EASILY SWAYED!!! hey, what's that over there Outta Here

[/quote]

that's o.k. then Idea

or

that's you, that's life. We inspire each other to find our life Heart

.

steve198329 · Hunter Joined: 03 Mar 2007 Posts: 110

Here is an update. I ate liver every day for about a week and 1/2. last tues day I ate about 1/2 lb of liver and I had diarehrea. I am not sure if this was an acute overdose of vitamin A or if I reached a saturation level from consuming it every day. So I stopped eating it for about 4 days. I will resume eating about 1/4 lb or less tommorrow and see if it botheres me again.

As of the the results on my sex drive. I have noticed a slight increase of my sex drive but I am not sure if it was placebo or if it was just spontaneous. I sometimes get a spontaneous increase of libido out of no where probably due to random resistance training. However I think it is still too early to make a conclusion.

Have you been noticing anything bigsea? Have you been eating liver? Whats the deal?

bigsea · Hunter Joined: 09 Jan 2007 Posts: 195

Hey Steve. I have been pming you but not getting anything back, hope you could respond i have questions for ya.
Ya i am eating liver daily too, i think you should ignore the vitamin a toxicity warnings its all bs. Think about it. The natives never thought of eating too much of something, if they wanted liver all day long and all nite pounds and pounds of it they would keep eating, they wouldn't think of a randomly calculated number and make sure they were eating under it.
I do think it's extremely strange however that only one kind of animal, polar bears, have a fatal liver dose. I think its strange, maybe their livers taste super super strong so you cant palate eating more than the fatal dose.

I haven't noticed anything different yet, except my skin seems very nice which makes sense because Vitamin A is good for the skin.. I also notice i just feel "calm" if that makes sense, like I feel as if im becoming more healthier from all the vitamins in the liver and i feel like im healthier than when i was just eating muscle meat.
Seriously to the people here, if you are only eating muscle meat you should definitely incorporate some organ meats, especially liver into your diet because its dirt cheap and it has so many other things that muscle meat has 0 of.

barb0324 · Guest

What exactly causes our libidos to increase? Is it the Vit A? Is it a hormone, like testasterone? Can we really influence it by adding certain foods? Guess I need to google this, but I'm just wondering, I've never really had a problem, so had no questions. But now I wonder...Eating protein and fat seems to help a lot of folks, but obviously not everyone.

I'm too tired right now, but will check it out tomorrow. And since there are so many really smart and informed folks here, thought I would ask.

Galeron · Posted: Thu Jun 21, 2007 1:56 am Post subject:

Galeron · Posted: Thu Jun 21, 2007 2:01 am Post subject:

bigsea · Hunter Joined: 09 Jan 2007 Posts: 195

galeron, your sex drive is low because you are relying on supplements which never work out.. well even if not synthetic, they aren't from natural food sources. you should just eat the foods high in Vitamin A instead of always relying on a supplement. even fish oil isn't really natural, its processed alot to get the oil out. instead of taking supplements which go straight thru you, just eat the food.

steve how are you doing with the liver? im doing great and have learned so many valuable things about diet recently, mostly that Vitamin A is extremely important, it builds all the hormones and together with sunlight from the sun they go hand in hand. my sex drive has definitely increased since eating liver daily, its nice to have it back again. however, it still isn't sykrocketing high like i wish it to be, but then again i have only started maybe 6 days eating liver daily so i need to give it more time..
i haven't noticed the body odor thing like you, i still smell, hahah

i look forward to the liver now its so good, muscle meat steaks taste so bland to me now, like they are just too plain and dull. i love the sweetness in liver!
im going to continue eating liver daily for awhile because the Vitamin A is helping me so much and i have so much more energy eating the liver now, its fantastic Happy

Tobias · Posted: Thu Jun 21, 2007 2:50 pm Post subject:

As long as I eat about a dozen of eggs every day and/or 1-2 pounds of red meat + butter/cream/fish oil/coconut oil my drive is sky high!

adwred · Posted: Thu Jun 21, 2007 3:07 pm Post subject:

Hi guys.

Most of you know my attitude towards supplementation, especially with fish oil. I've gone on about amines till I'm blue in the face. I'm looking at you, Galeron! Laugh

But I just want to point out one more thing. Vitamin A in high doses has farther reaching implications than just it's effect on Vitamin D (and vice versa). Remember that high doses of any vitamin (ESPECIALLY outside the context of a natural food that one would likely be able to eat on a daily basis) has a cascade effect on all sorts of other micronutrients. Vitamin A also antagonizes calcium absorption, among other things. Just keep that in mind while you're sucking down all that fish liver oil. Wink

Food is meant to be eaten as whole food, not as extracts. I really can't stress that enough. If you want to eat liver, then great. I love liver. Some of my best friends are liver-eaters. Just remember to use common sense.
_________________
I'm a vegetable-eater by proxy. I make sure to get 5-10 servings of herbivore per day.

bigsea · Hunter Joined: 09 Jan 2007 Posts: 195

steve198329 · Hunter Joined: 03 Mar 2007 Posts: 110

Yes, I have been noticing a slight increase in sex drive. Everything is working out great with my liver intake. I am now currently eating eat at least once a week. I stopped taking it everyday because I think I was overdoing it. It takes a while for hormones to balnace out so I am going to give it a couple more weeks before I can make any conclusion.

I do not like taking fish oil because for some reason it makes me sick and I feel bloated when I take it. Fish oil goes bad very quickly because it is a very unstable fat. Polyunsaturated fats also use up the vitamin A stores in your body to protect against free radical oxidation from what I have read. I prefer to get my vitamin A from liver because I like it and it is alot cheaper and probably healthier. I do not need to worry about getting vitamin D because I work out side in the open sunlight all day every day.

I try to minimize my consumption of chicken and eggs becasue of the high amount of omega 6. When I eat alot of chicken and/or eggs I start to get pimples on my legs and back. I am sure it is from the amount of omega 6 to omega 3 ratio because when I supplement with omega 3 or not eat chicken or eggs and just eat beef my pimples clear up. I don't like to supplement because too much polyunsaturated fats are not good so I try to eat more beef becase it has a 2:1 ratio of EFA's and I believe whole foods are a better source of EFAs.

bigsea · Hunter Joined: 09 Jan 2007 Posts: 195

woof_woof · Carnivore King Joined: 11 Sep 2006 Posts: 796

My sex drive doesn't change or decrease after 24 h fast and it's rather high or at least normal. I seldom go more then 24 h without food so I cannot say if it gets lower after longer fast.

copychick · Carnivore King Joined: 11 Aug 2006 Posts: 948

i thought you were gonna say....i seldom go 24 hours without sex.
i was prepared to be very jealous.

what about the omega three eggs? maybe they have a better ratio of fats, however, i still prefer the fertile eggs because their super hard shells impress me. (i hope avalon doesn't read this)

i got some eggs from a real farmer in prescott, they were SO tiny, and greenish colored. and they had that 'gamey' taste. are real eggs tiny? are these big eggs in the store like the amazon chickens bred to have DD breasts.

woof_woof · Carnivore King Joined: 11 Sep 2006 Posts: 796

LOL When I'm in relationship it's both. Why jealous? You sound lonely

copychick · Carnivore King Joined: 11 Aug 2006 Posts: 948

not lonely necessarily just haven't had sex in a very long time. but that's a whole 'nother thread entirely.

woof_woof · Carnivore King Joined: 11 Sep 2006 Posts: 796

copychick · Carnivore King Joined: 11 Aug 2006 Posts: 948

nah, it's just the totally boring same old story. girl meets boy. boy rips girl's bloody beating heart from her chestal cavity after 10 years. girl loses all interest in ever doing that again. i know, guys are not all like that. it's not a jaded/bitter thing so much as it is complete exhaustion at the thought of trying to really connect with someone again. the risk/reward ratio is not favorable.

i know i could just do a lighter sex romp kind of thing with someone, but i'm just not set up for that emotionally. Sad