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Avalon · Top Carnivore Joined: 29 Nov 2006 Posts: 3326

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/7600005.stm

Less meat, the better for the planet.

Best wishes,
Avalon

Erasmus · Hunter Joined: 20 Feb 2008 Posts: 142

So let me get this straight... A Hindu is opposed to eating cows?

I live in amazement.

-E

Flymaster · Newbie Joined: 30 Aug 2008 Posts: 5

This chap is a strict Hindu to whom cattle are sacred, he is also a strict vegetarian. What he proposes is for us to give up meat and eat veggies and grains and more soya (infertility anyone?). There are a few problems with this:

There isn't enough global land mass to grow enough food to feed everyone without global deforestation - I don't think we want to do that.

Most of the land mass is uncultivatable (is that a word?) due to its altitude, rockyness, sandyness, lack of water, too much water, built over etc. That restricts the working of the land. Where I live even the sheep find it hard going.

Rice paddies produce 100m tonnes of methane per year, cattle produce 115m tonnes per year. There are more people than cattle and when they all turn veggie and start producing their own methane ....... well you do the maths.

Finally, what does he propose we do with all the meat beasts - kill them and let them rot or turn them out to run wild in the street. He obviously hasn't thought this through properly. Maybe he needs a bit of brain boosting fat and meat in his diet.

Avalon · Top Carnivore Joined: 29 Nov 2006 Posts: 3326

Flymaster · Newbie Joined: 30 Aug 2008 Posts: 5

To be blunt...........no

Erasmus · Hunter Joined: 20 Feb 2008 Posts: 142

Uhh... no.

Nor do I believe that it is good for "the planet".

-E

Dustyboy · Posted: Mon Sep 08, 2008 7:56 pm Post subject:

The UN cracks me up. Without us there is no UN, no U.N. without U.S.
_________________
May the spirit of the dead cow be upon you.

Avalon · Top Carnivore Joined: 29 Nov 2006 Posts: 3326

...rriiiggghhhttt Roll Eyes

ReddyMcMeaty · The Boss Joined: 20 May 2006 Posts: 5776

[quote="Avalon"]

Avalon · Top Carnivore Joined: 29 Nov 2006 Posts: 3326

Well it might not be just about our own desires here.

I love fish and eggs. But if or when things get worse- like the fisheries drying up, I'll cut back willingly because we are not alone on this planet.

And with your interest in Pantheism, I'm surprised at your answer. So if it is deemed that in order to help the planet, or let's say other life forms as well, you wouldn't because you like your steak and eggs?

Roll Eyes

ReddyMcMeaty · The Boss Joined: 20 May 2006 Posts: 5776

The thing is, I don't believe it is healthy, and I don't believe it is "good for the planet." I can't even pretend, because the belief is so strong. There is a circle of life, animals eat animals. I'm part of that. I'm also unfortunately part of what humans have done to the world. I believe if we followed a more tribal/communal and carnivorous way of life that was about living, and eating and enjoying and loving and dying - instead of large scale control - nature's balance would be much more in order. You're not going to ever convince me that mass agriculture and control is a positive thing and that I should eschew meat to promote that. Even if certain people in prominent positions say so.
_________________
"Man lives on one quarter of what he eats. On the other three quarters lives his doctor."

Avalon · Top Carnivore Joined: 29 Nov 2006 Posts: 3326

My question was pretty simple and regardless of what is believed, you'd choose your own desires over the welfare of the planet. Which your children and their children will be living on. I'd asked if 'proven'. Granted, sometimes people don't know what they're talking about, but some times they do. And the question was if proven would you cut back and your answer was no and that is not in alignment with Pantheism and that is not pro-life because however we got on this rock, for the moment, it's all we have.

Life does feed on life. And Humans are pretty damn good at destroying life and everything around them in the name of God, Money and personal satisfaction.

I thank you for your answer though Sunny

Dustyboy · Posted: Tue Sep 09, 2008 1:06 pm Post subject:

Dirty hippy
_________________
May the spirit of the dead cow be upon you.

Avalon · Top Carnivore Joined: 29 Nov 2006 Posts: 3326

ohm

Funny, I just bought a tie-dye shirt at GoodWill yesterday Laugh

adwred · Posted: Tue Sep 09, 2008 1:31 pm Post subject:

If it was proven that large scale grain and soy agriculture was killing the planet, would you go carnivorous? No - that's a leap, isn't it? You'd probably start your own garden and grow your own vegetables and fruit, if you could - on a small scale ... become as self-sufficient as possible.

To say that never eating meat again would be the answer to saving the planet is an equal leap. If you said 'would you stick to local, organically grown meat only?' I could get behind that. Or even, 'would you hunt your own food or stick to road kill, like Carnation?' would be a more understandable next step, considering you're on a board of people who eat meat almost exclusively and find that to be the most healthy and appropriate human diet. To ask if they'd all go vegetarian ... well, to expect anything but the answers you've gotten is a stretch.
_________________
I'm a vegetable-eater by proxy. I make sure to get 5-10 servings of herbivore per day.

Avalon · Top Carnivore Joined: 29 Nov 2006 Posts: 3326

adwred · Posted: Tue Sep 09, 2008 2:08 pm Post subject:

Dustyboy · Posted: Tue Sep 09, 2008 2:11 pm Post subject:

Hey its Red and Green, its like Christmas......sorry.
_________________
May the spirit of the dead cow be upon you.

Dustyboy · Posted: Tue Sep 09, 2008 2:18 pm Post subject:

Maybe it just seems like it has been going on forever. I know that I am having one of those days.
_________________
May the spirit of the dead cow be upon you.

Avalon · Top Carnivore Joined: 29 Nov 2006 Posts: 3326

LOL Dusty

adwred · Posted: Tue Sep 09, 2008 2:20 pm Post subject:

Avalon · Top Carnivore Joined: 29 Nov 2006 Posts: 3326

Is that a piercing joke? Roll Eyes

Double Vertical Labret perhaps?

Dustyboy · Posted: Tue Sep 09, 2008 2:39 pm Post subject:

Did someone try to seal your mouth shut?
_________________
May the spirit of the dead cow be upon you.

Avalon · Top Carnivore Joined: 29 Nov 2006 Posts: 3326

I did

the video's on Youtube shameless pinhole promotion Cool

Dustyboy · Posted: Tue Sep 09, 2008 2:43 pm Post subject:

Trying to make the voices stop hunh? Been there.
_________________
May the spirit of the dead cow be upon you.

Carnation · Top Carnivore Joined: 15 Dec 2007 Posts: 3586

Might I recommend the book the Compassionate Carnivore by Catherine Friend. She addresses the idea of vegetarianism saving the world quite nicely, from a carnivore's (and rancher's) point of view. And believe it or not, you don't have to own a pasture and cows in order to partake of sustainable farming practices. In my experience, the people that whinge about not being able to afford meat from sustainable farms are the same ones who piss away most of their money on booze (or some other vice).

Avalon · Top Carnivore Joined: 29 Nov 2006 Posts: 3326

Carnation · Top Carnivore Joined: 15 Dec 2007 Posts: 3586

For the nutrition I'd get, I'd pay $8/lb for beef over $3/lb for asparagus any day. Yes, pastured meat does cost more, but you are paying for a whole cycle of things which represent quality, not just for you or the animal, but for the planet.

And there are plenty of way to get inexpensive quality meat. My income offically qualifies me for poverty level by US standards, yet I'm able to afford good meat for myself and three other people, four cats, and two dogs. We ate roadkill for an entire year in order to save up for a whole pastured cow. When you buy a whole cow, it turns out to be just over $2/lb. Not enough freezer space, split it with 4-6 other people, they're not hard to find.

$2/lb still too expensive? Freecycle. Every year at this time, hunters are giving away (they are not allowed to sell it legally in the us) last years' meat - deer, elk, turkey, you name it. Where there's a will, there's a way.

Anyhow, yawn. Roll Eyes

ReddyMcMeaty · The Boss Joined: 20 May 2006 Posts: 5776

Carnation · Top Carnivore Joined: 15 Dec 2007 Posts: 3586

And for those who truly cannot afford much meat in their diet, there is always the WAPF wisdom that a gelatin-rich bone broth acts as a sort of protein sparer and allows the body to make best use of the protein ingested.